Saw V Discussion # 3

[Uncle Hoody]

Old Thread (http://www.f13-community.co.uk/board/showthread.php?t=2598)

[Jigsaw]

Thanks for opening this.

I doubt the early review of the film is real, but who knows if the reviewer may have seen it during the post-production process. It's not likely, but it's not impossible or improbable.

[Ron]

Even if that early review is a fake, I would still like for that to be true of this film. I want there to be a really great twist ending that brings me back to the first two films...the type of ending that you don't see coming.

[Jigsaw]

I hope so as well. I hope Saw V will harken back to the first two movies.

[Sean [The Wildcard]]

I'm slowly having faith in this film now.

Hopefully it does channel the first two...namely the first one, though.

:D

[Jigsaw]

Regardless of whether Amanda is alive or dead, I'm getting more excited and hopeful for this film.

[Kat]

I hope this movie goes back to being a good story telling thriller, rather than pointless gore. It seemed like after 2, they just went with 'let's see how disturbing and gross we can be', rather then 'let's tell a cool psychological horror/thriller story, with some cool kills/traps in it'. Take TCM for example, hardly any gore in the original, but it was still creepy/thrilling/scary as hell. I think it shows laziness on filmmakers parts (not just SAW but horror and thrillers overall).

[Jigsaw]

I agree, it seems with Saw III the series started focusing more on the gore and torture. Saw IV was more psychological than III, but IMO not on the same level as the first two. It seemed Saw III tried to cash in on the success of Hostel. I hope the filmmakers of Saw V will make it more in-tune with the first two movies.

[Scarecrow]

I think the series changed after Part 1 to be honest. Soon as Jigsaw took centre stage we hada major icon and a horror series instead of an insane philosophy and an avatar for that in a horror-thriller. It'd be like Se7en being followd by a series where John Doe is at the cenre and killing many in elaborate ways.


- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

I think that Saw II, while centering more on Jigsaw and his traps, still had plenty of the first film's psychology and delved deeper into Jigsaw's mind and philosophy. I don't think it was until Saw III that the series focused more on gore, torture and death.

[Ron]

I felt cheated by Saw III. In Saw II we were given a solid accomplice/follower of Jigsaw, but Saw III took that away from us.

[DRE]

I agree with that Peter.

[jeff_brister2004]

I would like the Saw V score to go back to something similar to the first Saw. The music added so much dread to the movie...

[The Dream Master]

I think part 2 and 3 follow pretty much the same pattern of putting people into traps, and they're both violent and gory. The only difference I see is that the ones in 3 aren't as random and have more thought put into them. For the matter, 4 was pretty much the same, as the narrative is basically strung together by a series of traps, so I'd say that the traps really have been a centerpiece in that respect since part 2. In the first one, all the traps (besides the main one involving Adam and Gordon) were there to just establish Jigsaw's M.O.

[Jigsaw]

I felt cheated by Saw III. In Saw II we were given a solid accomplice/follower of Jigsaw, but Saw III took that away from us.


You all know this is exactly how I feel. I still feel betrayed and cheated by Saw III for this reason.

[The Dream Master]

If by "solid accomplice" you mean "mentally and emotionally unstable accomplice," then yeah, I guess. :X

[Jigsaw]

Who's to say Amanda wouldn't overcome those obstacles to become a solid successor to John.

[The Dream Master]

The writers of Saw 3. :X

[Jigsaw]

Indeed, and they're idiots for that.

[DRE]

I'll bet if you ask Leigh Whannell if he would have done things differently for Saw III today, he would say yes. I think he was under pressure to deliver a quick script and took the direction he did because it was supposed to be "The End" and he wanted to leave them with a difficult way to continue if they decided to keep going.

[The Dream Master]

On the other hand, he could have been thinking about how fanboys often whine that their favorite series end up jumping the shark after so many entries, so he tried to wrap up his own creation.

[Jigsaw]

I'll bet if you ask Leigh Whannell if he would have done things differently for Saw III today, he would say yes. I think he was under pressure to deliver a quick script and took the direction he did because it was supposed to be "The End" and he wanted to leave them with a difficult way to continue if they decided to keep going.


I think so, too. I also think the fact that Saw III was obviously rushed into production, he had no real time to think over what he may have wanted to do or considered doing. I always got the impression that Saw III had a very troubled and problematic production due to it being rushed, and the lack of any good behind-the-scenes footage on the DVD (and the complete lack of such footage on the Director's Cut) sort of re-affirms that for me. I wouldn't doubt there were a lot of on-set fights and disputes, and I don't doubt a lot of them had to do with what Shawnee wanted to do with Amanda. I think the reason we haven't heard much about Saw III possibly having a difficult production is because of the movie's success.

[The Dream Master]

Didn't Shawnee Smith come back just to play Amanda's corpse in part 4? I've got to think she couldn't have been all that pissed if she agreed to do that, unless she was under contract. And a movie's success has nothing to do with not hearing about a troubled production. Apocalypse Now was successful, and everyone knows the production for it was hell. Same with Jaws.

[Jigsaw]

It's still not know for sure if Shawnee returned for Saw IV or if that was just leftover stock footage combined with a stand-in. If Saw III had a troubled production, it's possible maybe the studio just doesn't feel comfortable disclosing the details about it publicly.

[The Dream Master]

Or, the production might not have been troubled at all; no use in speculating over it in an attempt to justify how the movie turned out. You hated it because Amanda was killed and try to claim because the movie was rushed. People who didn't like Saw II or Saw IV can say the same about those. All the productions have been rushed.

[Jigsaw]

Whoa, I never said that. I was just saying maybe Saw III had an overly rushed and difficult production and one that was moreso than the other sequels. I also hate Saw III for reasons outside of the Amanda debacle.

[The Dream Master]

Whoa, I never said that.

I also think the fact that Saw III was obviously rushed into production, he had no real time to think over what he may have wanted to do or considered doing.

The fact is, all of the movies have had the same production schedule. I have no problem with someone just manning up and saying "I don't like part 3 because Amanda was killed," but to criticize it for being rushed and overly gory (while ignoring the fact that part 2 shares those qualities) just rings hollow.

[Jigsaw]

At least Saw II has some psychology to it and still has a decent plot to back everything up, Saw III is mostly gore for gore's sake.

[The Dream Master]

I'm not even getting into this because I think we all know how many holes have been poked in that argument over the last two years.

[Jigsaw]

Indeed, agree to disagree.

[Kat]

I liked SAW and SAW 2 (not to be bitchy but I used the word LIKED because I actually no longer care for horror or thrillers that much) but the 3rd just was over doing it. They should have left it at 2 IMHO.

[The Dream Master]

See, it took a second viewing for me to warm up a bit to Saw III because I found that it had a little too much plot (which I why I think it's silly to say that part 3 has no plot to back up the gore) and the characters of Jeff and Lynn just weren't all that compelling. I still don't think those two light the world on fire, but I do enjoy the story quite a bit now. I liked that it wasn't a by-the-numbers, "let's throw some people in a room and have them encounter random traps" sequel. I still think the first is the best, though.

[Kat]

The first one actually half assed surprised me with the twists and turns. 2nd one was really damn enjoyable (at the time to me), 3rd was OK (even plot wise for me) but I still felt cheated by it, it didn't live up to what it could have been and I blame most of that on a rush job and a 'let's end it' approach. I still can't believe they are up to 5 movies already. That is the one thing that pisses me off about horror (ALL horror) - the 5 million sequels and the sure to follow rip offs to the big name movies (Friday, Nightmare, Saw, TCM, Halloween and so forth).

[The Dream Master]

I just can't get behind criticizing it for being a rush job, either because they've all been rush jobs. I just don't see anything that indicates that it suffered anymore than the other two because of it. I guess some people might see the "ending of the series" attempt as rushing things in the larger context because I guess people were expecting to get at least one full movie with Amanda as apprentice. I don't see it that way, though because I don't think Saw II promised anything like that. I don't criticize Friday 4 for not featuring a zombie Pam killing kids, and I don't criticize part 6 for not having Tommy as the killer because both of those movies turned out just fine.

[Kat]

I guess some people might see the "ending of the series" attempt as rushing things in the larger context because I guess people were expecting to get at least one full movie That is about how I feel... Sure the others were rushed, but I feel in a different way. I honestly don't give a damn if they had John or Amanda or some other fool as the killer or apprentice. I felt it was boring compared to the other two, and just didn't have the overall feel of it.

One thing I agree with Jigsaw is the 'Hostel' feel. I feel the same way about this movie as I do St. Anger with Metallica, it was OK, had some good points (probably great as stand alone), but it just didn't have the same good old feeling as the rest of them.

[The Dream Master]

Yeah, it did feel a little off-putting to me the first time I saw it, I admit that. I don't think it feels like Hostel at all though, especially in regards to gore and torture because I just don't see it as being any different than the other 2, which featured people getting burned alive, cut to death by barbed wire, slicing their own skin off, sawing their own leg off, getting shot in the face, falling into syringe pits, etc. That traps were more elaborate in 3, but I think a sequel should escalate things to a certain extent.

[Kat]

Yeah, I totally understand that too, I admit I liked it a little more during my 2nd viewing of it, not to get off topic, but that is what I liked about the Chucky movies, it has always been the same writer and almost the same crew. The Saw series got too big, too quick for it's own good IMHO. Honestly, it is like with Friday movies, sometimes I have a hard time remembering which one I am watching, where the continuity falls or even keeping up with the stories. I think it just becomes, let's just make a movie, without thinking of production value.

I guess rushed is the wrong word. I could paint a picture and take 10 years to do it and it could look like a 5 minute job or I could paint a masterpiece in 5 minutes and it could look great. Value I guess is a better word.

[Jigsaw]

I definitely feel the Saw series should've ended with Saw II, if they couldn't think of better directions to steer the series in with the third film. Better to quit while you're ahead.

[Jack Bauer]

Tell the truth, I could have seen SAW III as being Amanda's time to shine with her as Jigsaw. But given that SAW III was rushed into production, it was written badly and directed horrible. Wait, does that sound familiar?

[jayTL]

I swear, I must be the only one to like all 4... They were all different in style and tone...but all of them were interesting (at least to me)

[The Dream Master]

I like all 4 on different levels. I can't say I hate any of them; part 4 is my least favorite, but even it is very watchable. I'm not a fanboy for the series by any means, and I don't think it stands among the best horror franchises ever, but, relative to each other, all have been about the same quality.

[Jigsaw]

Saw II is my favorite and the original is close behind it. I find Saw IV to be okay, but Saw III, well, you all know my feelings on that.

I have yet to watch all four in a row, but I'll do so on October 23rd to prepare for Saw V. I had myself a little Sawfest for the past two years, watching the first two before the release day of Saw III and the first three the release day before Saw IV.

[El Rooto]

II is the only one I dislike a lot, but I thought IV wasn't that great, either.

[Jigsaw]

The main problem I have with Saw IV is that it tries to do too much at once and have the plot of two movies crammed into one with mixed results, or at least two hours worth of material crammed into a 90-minute movie. Another problem I have is the overkill of the quick cuts and transitions (especially during Ivan's torture scene), and I also didn't care for the backstory it gave Jigsaw, although it's grown on me.

[Ron]

I thought that Bousman's transition shots brought a fresh look to the second film, but they got really old over the course of the last two sequels.

[Jack Bauer]

Another problem I have is the overkill of the quick cuts and transitions (especially during Ivan's torture scene)
Given the nature of the trap and the reason behind it, maybe that the angle that they (DLB, the producers, and/or the editor) were going for the scene.

[DRE]

No, it's just that Bousman thinks this whole transition thing is his signature and he goes too far trying to be creative, and some of them quite are, while others are just overkill.

[Jigsaw]

As much as I hate Saw III, I felt it had the best transition shots and quick cuts, as they smooth and not overdone, and actually quite stylish and creative in parts. Can't say the same for Saw IV, where IMO it was really overdone to the point of being distracting and even annoying.

[Jack Bauer]

The funniest transition shot was the one where Dina had to run across set and into the tub. I hate the one where Brenda is thrown into the mirror and the next shot is the officer who passes by.

Speaking of which:

I think Officers like Fisk might be getting expended roles in the next one?

[Scarecrow]

The transitions never really bothgered me and I can't say they stick in my mind either.


- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

I hate the one where Brenda is thrown into the mirror and the next shot is the officer who passes by.

Speaking of which:

I think Officers like Fisk might be getting expended roles in the next one?


I hated that shot as well, so distracting.

Regarding your question, I don't know if Fisk is returning or not.

[Jack Bauer]

Although Fisk was part of the Jigsaw case, making him see a prime target for Jigsaw's next helper.

[Jigsaw]

Check out the new Halloween blood drive poster for Saw V (http://www.bloody-disgusting.com/news/13326).

Looks like someone's been watching too much Hellraiser :side:

[DRE]

I expected to see "You know who" for real, the way BD was saying.

[Jigsaw]

It is BD after all, you know how they are :X

[Scarecrow]

Heh, funky. :D


- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

The teaser trailer for Saw V gave me an idea: what if John doesn't have another apprentice at all set to test Hoffman, but rather, Strahm is being put through a test of his own and after he survives the Head Box Trap (if he even does), what if Strahm's test is to test Hoffman? Basically, Strahm would end up like Zep or Art, a lackey who does some of John's work but isn't an actual apprentice. Maybe the apprentice twist in Saw V is that there is no other apprentice and Strahm was set to test Hoffman as a major part of his own test.

[Ron]

Good theory Jiggy...isn't there supposed to be a 6th installment though? Where do you think they could go from there?

[Jigsaw]

Who knows. It's probably too early to speculate on what'll happen during Saw VI.

[Scarecrow]

They move on from the bloody apprentice plotline hopefully...


- Scarecrow

[Ron]

I don't think they'll abandon the whole apprentice plotline. It's kind of become the bread and butter of the series at this point. These films still rely heavily on a 'whodunit" story.

[Jigsaw]

i-ytxV3qz1Q


Credit to Vinc360 from the House Of Jigsaw if that is indeed a part of the real score. Sounds amazing if it is.

[Ron]

If that is an actual snippet of the score it sounds awesome. It almost has a 'Flight of the Bumble Bee' feel to it.

[Jigsaw]

I wonder when we'll get to see the full-length trailer for this movie? I bet it'll be attached to Cabin Fever 2. I have to say I'm glad very little has been revealed about the film thus far, because IMO far too much was revealed in the previews for the last two films, and Darren Lynn Bousman even made the mistake of alluding to some of the twists, such as Hoffman being in on it. David Hackl seems to have avoided the same mistakes.

[Ron]

Wait...when is Cabin Fever 2 being released?? Damn, how the hell did I miss that!?

[DRE]

That was a nice piece of music. I don't own any of Clouser's Saw scores, I think I'll look into getting some of them.

[Jigsaw]

Yes, Cabin Fever 2 comes out next month, PB.

Dre, I own the first three soundtracks, they're great, but I also hope to get the original scores someday. I think the Saw III score is the best overall, a lot of excellent tracks are on there.

[The Dream Master]

Wait...when is Cabin Fever 2 being released?? Damn, how the hell did I miss that!?

September 12th, allegedly, but I've not seen it officially announced. Heck, I'm not even sure it's not going DTV.

[Jigsaw]

Cabin Fever 2: Spring Fever (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabin_Fever_2) is set for a theatrical release on September 12th.

[Jack Bauer]

The music was tight, maybe it's Strahm finding out it was Hoffman.

[Ron]

I can't believe that snuck by me..thank's for the inadvertent 'heads up' Jig.;)

[Jigsaw]

Sure :cool:

It really is a crime the original Saw III score has yet to get a release over here in the U.S. Here's some tracks from it (http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=lovethegames&search_query=Saw+III) (thanks to Lovethegames for uploading them).

[The Dream Master]

Cabin Fever 2: Spring Fever (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabin_Fever_2) is set for a theatrical release on September 12th.

There's no references on that page that show me any confirmation for September 12th. All the usual places I hit for release dates don't even have it listed at all, and the movie's Myspace page doesn't even have anything. If it's coming out next month, somebody sure as hell doesn't want us to know about it.

[Jigsaw]

Saw Attraction Trailer (http://www.livesaw.com)


Cool trailer, but it doesn't show how the attraction itself works. I live in Las Vegas, and if I could make it there, I would.

[DRE]

I would like to go to that. It seems cool.

[Jigsaw]

I hope it's a cool attraction, like what Universal Studios does during Halloween Horror Nights. I wonder if any Saw cast or alumni will attend the opening of the attraction?

[Jack Bauer]

Most likely Tobin, Shawnee, and some of the victi...test subjects.

[DRE]

Yeah I would think most of the cast of the new film and a few old faces would show.

[Jigsaw]

I'd love to go if I could. I know I could've met Shawnee last year in L.A. when she was at Universal Studios along with other Horror celebrities at the opening of Halloween Horror Nights.

[Jigsaw]

New Saw V Poster Unveiled (Nothing Too Spoilerish) (http://www.bloody-disgusting.com/news/13462)

[DRE]

They're trying to get to us.....

How will it end?! I wanna know damn it!

Other than the tagline, it's a rather basic poster, nothing too dynamic.


Strahm is on the poster and the only person in the teaser, he's being imposed on us, subliminal hints?

[Jack Bauer]

Interesting. Could the tag line be a line in the film?

[El Rooto]

"You won't believe how it ends"?

Pretty big words there. Maybe the twist is supernatural...or not. :side:

[Jigsaw]

They're trying to get to us.....

How will it end?! I wanna know damn it!

Other than the tagline, it's a rather basic poster, nothing too dynamic.


Strahm is on the poster and the only person in the teaser, he's being imposed on us, subliminal hints?


I rather like that the poster is basic, it doesn't reveal overly much. I do wonder if Strahm being featured on the advertising is a hint there's more to him than we think.

[DRE]

The man in the teaser poster could very well be Patterson, if you study the hairline, sideburns and ear.


link (http://a.media.abcfamily.go.com/abcfamily/Shows/GilmoreGirls/Luke_large.jpg)

[Jigsaw]

Fans have been speculating that. That could mean either Strahm is an apprentice or at least he's being put through a test where he has to test Hoffman.

[Jack Bauer]

If Strahm was an apprentice or helper, then why was he tested in IV? He would have known that the Billy would have gone Boom.

[Jigsaw]

That wasn't a test, that was a warning.

[Jack Bauer]

It looked like a test to me, even Jigsaw put down the whole Jeff would be killed. Are they trying to say that a dying man is all-knowing?

[Jigsaw]

It was a warning, the tape even said so.

[Jack Bauer]

I see, so if it was a warning then how can he be a helper of Jigsaw?

[Jigsaw]

We don't even know if he is a helper or is being co-erced into it with his test.

[DRE]

And even if he is the apprentice that doesn't mean he wouldn't play along in order to keep cover. Hoffman played along, Amanda played along.

[Jigsaw]

That as well. Jigsaw even did that in the original Saw by posing as the corpse in the bathroom. All of the Jigsaw Killers employ that kind of trickery.
ADDED:
Major detail of Strahm's trap revealed in this picture (http://img2.timeinc.net/ew/dynamic/imgs/080826/Saw-5_l.jpg), view at your own risk if you don't want any spoilers whatsoever.

[DRE]

I thought it would have been some kind of gas. Water is good.

[Jack Bauer]

Poor Strahm, what did the Jack Bauer of SAW do to have this fate?

[Jigsaw]

I like how Strahm's trap looks to be more of a psychological trap rather than a gruesome one, like a lot of the ones from Saw III and IV were. This trap also looks a tad more simplistic, which is good.

[Jack Bauer]

I wonder if the glass is breakable, then how does one get out of the box like that? But still it reminds me of Allison's trap from SAW II.

[Jigsaw]

You mean Addison.

I guess we'll learn more of the details of the trap when we see the movie on October 24th. Kind if interesting to note that between the new poster and the promotional marketing so far on this movie, Strahm's head box trap is becoming like the Jaw Splitter from the first Saw.

[Jack Bauer]

Yeah, that's who I meant and knowing me it's damn near annoying for those two names.

Nah, the Jaw Splitter trap will be my all-time trap. It set the tone for Jigsaw's plan.

[Jigsaw]

Numerous New Saw V Pictures (Possible Spoilers, Click Link At Your Own Discretion) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/30072131@N08/sets/72157607007856880)


I guess the hood over the face is Hoffman's signature look, much like John's robe and Amanda's pig mask.

[Jack Bauer]

He looks like the Fisherman from the I Know films.

[Jigsaw]

It looks like we'll be seeing some Saw II flashbacks, given the still of Jigsaw in what looks like the starting room of the Traphouse. I'm curious as to what the still of him with a shaved head and wearing black is from, probably a pre-Saw 1 or post-Saw 1 flashback.

[Jack Bauer]

The Jill pic reminds me of Starship Troopers.

[Jigsaw]

I just hope that picture doesn't allude to her as an apprentice or accomplice :| Maybe it's a funeral picture, maybe from a flashback of Gideon's funeral or even John's.

[Jack Bauer]

Most likely the former because no one would have gone to John's

[Jigsaw]

And I'd assume by the picture of Strahm wearing a leather jacket that he survives his trap.

[Jack Bauer]

Yes, or a flashback.

But am I the only one who loathes how they turned John Kramer from being the anti-villain to a tragic villain. The cancer was already bad enough for him, but they put the death of a baby in the mix which is bad enough.

[Jigsaw]

I dislike that a lot as well, IMO they should've just kept John as a psychopathic figure with a God's complex, as he was in the first three. I think Amanda works for being a tragic villain because of the abuse she suffered as a child, but I think making John to be a tragic villain kind of ruins him a bit.

[Jack Bauer]

I think the whole Amanda being a tragic figure was already present in the first film.

[Jigsaw]

I think Saw III hinted at it, but it's only from some of the interviews and DVD commentaries that cement it.

[Ron]

Betsy Russell is hot. I've loved her ever since Cheerleader Camp.

[Jigsaw]

I think she's not a bad actress, but for some reason I don't find her that attractive, at least not in the Saw films :meh: Then again, I think any other woman in the Saw series has a hard time comparing to Shawnee...

[Jack Bauer]

Hey what about Dina, Beverley, and Emmanuelle?

[Jigsaw]

I like Dina and Beverley, but they have the tough task of competing with Shawnee.

Speaking of Beverley, she'll be appearing at Sawmania (http://www.sawmania.com). Kind of cool, as I always liked Laura in Saw II and felt Beverley has gotten too much flack for her role in the film.

[Jack Bauer]

I love how Mark has free autographs under his credit.

[Jigsaw]

The still of John with a shaved head and the timer behind him as well as Mike Butters' appearance at Sawmania has me wondering if we'll see a flashback harkening back to the original Saw with the Razor Wire Cage.

[Jack Bauer]

He was in the clinic along with Tony, Gus, and LaRose, and they already did Amanda's flashback so why not Paul, the one man whom John believe to be a family man.

[Jigsaw]

Speaking of Gus, the man's feet in the Traphouse still look like they belong to Gus.

[Jack Bauer]

The thing with SAW films, you get whomever has the time. Bit characters like Gus and Troy, the actors weould be able to come back and explore their back-story, but I wonder why Dr. Gordon was shown last.

[Jigsaw]

That still was mistakenly added, it's just a screen capture from the first Saw.

[Jack Bauer]

I know, but I think it's the whole keep Gordon alive MO that has been going around since the end of SAW. Hell, a lot of people believed that Adam would be helped by the cops. I wonder though if Hoffman was one of Det. on the case by then and might have killed Gordon.

[Jigsaw]

We may or may not find that out.

I wonder where this film may be set? It looks like the main games may be in a sewer or something similar, going by the large pipe Luba's in.

[Scarecrow]

Heard "The Midnight Meat Train" may be getting its UK release on the same day as Saw V and I've already started seeing Tv spots for the film, two months early! If so, Saw V may just have soem competition here!


- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

A double feature of this and MMT would be awesome. Maybe even a triple feature with those two plus Trick 'r Treat, which needs to see the light of day.

[Ron]

I wonder if Dr.Gordon's fate will remain an unsolved mystery?

[Jigsaw]

There seems to be a high chance of that.

[Ron]

Hopefully not. For me, that would bring the series to a nirvana of sorts. They've already given closure to Adam and Detective Matthews, two focal characters in the series, so why not Dr.Gordon? This is just my own wishful thinking though.

[Apocalypto]

Tobin said that Gordon will be back at some point, not sure if he actually knows it's planned or if he's just stating his opinion on it though, since I don't think he actually has much say on it.

[The Dream Master]

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/imgcache/34145.imgcache

Interesting that so much of the promotional material has revolved around that trap.

[Don]

If that trap somehow involves the transfering of Jigsaw's soul into said victim's body... I will shit myself. And not be that shocked and be oddly OK with it

[Apocalypto]

Not big on the new poster, I prefer the flesh-faced one.

[The Dream Master]

I'm intrigued by the tagline of the new poster, but I think the trailer kind of stole the thunder for the trap featured here. It's still pretty cool; I like the color scheme alright, too.

[Jigsaw]

The tagline for this movie has me curious as well. It must have one Hell of a twist finish.

[Jack Bauer]

After the lackluster endings of III and IV?

Yeah, it could be interesting.

[Jigsaw]

I don't think the endings of the first two films will ever be topped, especially the original. You know the main twists and endings will never be topped when the fourth installment resorts to blatantly rehashing two of the first sequel's biggest twists.

[Scarecrow]

I doubt it's really rehashing. The whole concept of Saw IV is to follow up Saw III's ending where the audience believes Jigsaw is dead. So apart from revealing soemone cacklign behind a door, we always had to have a reveal of someone involved, I think it pulled it off. And the time alterations were ina different way to Part 2. I think the need for a big twist has become over emphasised, somewhat. I don't think they all need to be a big shocker, it can simply be a twist in the story which is more what Part 3 had.


- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

I'm happy to see that we'll likely re-visit the Traphouse, and wonder if we might see the bathroom again. It's a given we'll be back at the Gideon Meat Plant for the opening scene, going by Strahm's trap and the background of it.

[Kat]

I am honestly thinking that the ending will be lackluster, as in "I don't fucking believe it! I want my money back!" as it was with Saw 3 for myself... I hope I am wrong though.

[Jigsaw]

I still feel cheated and gypped by not only Saw III's ending, but the movie as a whole. It seems Saw V will be more in-tune with Saw II, which has me very happy.

[Scarecrow]

Unless Amands stumbles out in the opening proclaiming "I'm Alive!" only to get hit by a bus, knocked into a petrol pump which explodes, she stumbles burning into a giant fan which rips her to shreds and then wild dogs eat the remains....

:p


- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

Well, that kind of ending won't make me a happy camper...

[Sean [The Wildcard]]

I would love to see Amanda return...then have the Blob show up.

Seriously.
I want to see that happen.

:D

[Jigsaw]

Maybe the twist of Saw V is that Meg Penny from The Blob is set to be the new Jigsaw, thus enabling Shawnee's return to the series.

[Ron]

I'm looking forward to this. I hope it's a real shocker.

[Jigsaw]

I don't think the twists of the first two Saws will ever be topped, it's impossible.

[Ron]

I would never say that it's impossible, just very difficult for them to top.

[Apocalypto]

Eh, "he was on the floor the whole time!" isn't really a spectacular twist for me, it was basically all shock value and no meaning; and I predicted the SAW II twist almost a year before the movie came out.

I still love both films, I hardly find the twists unbeatable though.

[The Dream Master]

The big twist for me is the revelation that Jigsaw was a cancer-ridden patient that we'd already seen more than anything. I like the fact that this gave the killer a more complex motive than "oh, he's fucked up, etc. etc." Him being on the floor the whole time is kind of neat I guess, but, like you said, all shock value with no point. With part 2, I knew Amanda would end up being in on the whole thing; I didn't get the time twist, though. That was clever.

[Jigsaw]

I thought both of the Saw II twists were very clever and surprising. Most surprising for me was the return to the bathroom.

[The Dark Vampire]

I would think a obvious twist would be Jill was in on it with John/Jigsaw's all the time but like I said that (to me) is a to obvious way to go so I doubt they will do it unless they pull a double swerve as in we're expecting it so much we don't think it will happen so they do it.

or maybe not

[Jigsaw]

I'm hoping they don't go that route with Jill. Not only is it way too predictable and random, it's blatantly rehashing the Amanda and Hoffman twists.

[Apocalypto]

The big twist for me is the revelation that Jigsaw was a cancer-ridden patient that we'd already seen more than anything. I like the fact that this gave the killer a more complex motive than "oh, he's fucked up, etc. etc." Him being on the floor the whole time is kind of neat I guess, but, like you said, all shock value with no point. With part 2, I knew Amanda would end up being in on the whole thing; I didn't get the time twist, though. That was clever.

Me too, I loved the cancer patient aspect, what most seem to focus on in my experience is that "OMG HE WAS ON THE FLOOR THE WHOLE TIME!" though, which for me, just made me think "yeah...so?"

I liked the idea of everyone in the house being Eric's sins coming back to haunt him, but they revealed it midway through the movie when they told you they were all people he wrongfully arrested though, and I figured Amanda would be working with John from the moment she said "He...helped me" in SAW.

[The Dark Vampire]

I'm hoping they don't go that route with Jill. Not only is it way too predictable and random, it's blatantly rehashing the Amanda and Hoffman twists.


I agree I hope the closest they will go is that she had some idea that Jigsaw could be John but wasn't 100% sure.

As for that I hope we have seen the last of the guys been his assistants if they go on any more more ppl will be his assistants him than not

[Apocalypto]

I'd be shocked if there's no new apprentice in SAW V...that'd be the most shocking SAW twist to date.

[Jigsaw]

One possibility I've been wondering is that maybe John has no other accomplices outside of Amanda and Hoffman, and that Strahm's test is to test Hoffman. I think Strahm could end up being like Zep in that he's used as a pawn in another person's game.

[The Dream Master]

I'd be shocked if there's no new apprentice in SAW V...that'd be the most shocking SAW twist to date.

I can't remember the exact wording, but I think all Jigsaw's recorded message only tells Hoffman that he shouldn't expect to go untested; for all we know, Jigsaw already rigged a trap for Hoffman on his own, so there may not be another apprentice.

[Apocalypto]

But without another apprentice, how could he get him into it?

[The Dark Vampire]

But without another apprentice, how could he get him into it?

I'd go with (Our) Jigsaw's idea he forces Strahm (or someone else) to play against their will

[The Dream Master]

That's the tricky part if there's not another apprentice. The way this series is, who knows?

[The Dark Vampire]

Maybe he has to test himself or even put himself into the trap to test his loyalty to Jigsaw and the cause

[Ron]

Hoffman would have to believe in Jigaw's 'teachings' 100% in order to put himself in a trap to prove his loyalty to the "cause". Either that or be pretty suicidal or stupid.

[The Dark Vampire]

Hoffman would have to believe in Jigaw's 'teachings' 100% in order to put himself in a trap to prove his loyalty to the "cause". Either that or be pretty suicidal or stupid.

I agree but it's one of the only ways they could do it

I'm unsure if he would I'm almost certain Amanda would have done it though.

[Apocalypto]

Amanda pretty much did do it by willingly putting herself in the trap house.

[The Dark Vampire]

Amanda pretty much did do it by willingly putting herself in the trap house.
True

I also think that part of the reason Amanda was there was to keep Daniel safe from the others and the traps as he was always meant to survive as he had done nothing wrong.

[Ron]

I think Amanda was far more emotionally unstable than Hoffman, but we still don't know very much about him at this point, so who knows.

[Jigsaw]

True

I also think that part of the reason Amanda was there was to keep Daniel safe from the others and the traps as he was always meant to survive as he had done nothing wrong.


I agree, and also think she genuinely liked Daniel and wanted him to survive, which could also add to her hatred of Eric, since Daniel and Eric didn't have the best of relationships. I do wonder though if Hoffman may have possibly set Eric up for his crimes of even tampered with Amanda's games in Saw III to make them impossible to survive. I have a feeling Hoffman's true nature is very sinister and evil.

[Jack Bauer]

I always think of Hoffman being a cop doesn't play by the rules when nothing else works. For all we know he might be deep undercover and didn't tell anyone of his plans.

[Don]

I was thinking the deep undercover thing myself. But to me that seems to obvious. Im honestly half expecting this oen to move the series into some supernatural element or something. Something with Straham becoming Jigsaw like John possesing him or something and Joraham killing Hoffman for failing his test. And then our games will really begin

[Jigsaw]

Hoffman could be deep undercover, but he strikes me as someone with ulterior motives and a very sinister, malicious agenda.

[Scarecrow]

The real question is whether Hoffman will be able to stick to the rules and philosophy of Jigsaw or will he simply enjoy the kill. As a cop he just may, seeing the failure in the systema nd wanting to force criminals to change their ways through the tests.

- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

For some reason, Hoffman strikes me as the type who enjoys killing, but I guess we'll know for sure in a little over a month from now.

[Ron]

I personally think that Jigsaw knew that Hoffman didn't care about his "work", merely used him for his strength to setup traps.

[Jigsaw]

I think Jigsaw had some suspicions regarding Hoffman.

Also, here's this new Amanda toy available in the UK (http://www.play.com/Gadgets/Gadgets/4-/6534013/Saw-Reverse-Bear-Trap-Supersized-Xtreme-Dform-Figure/Product.html#). Looks rather inaccurate to her appearance in the film.

[The Dream Master]

I don't think they were going for extreme accuracy considering it's one of those super deformed figures.

[Jigsaw]

I hope one day NECA makes several movie-accurate Amanda figures for their Cult Classics line and also figures of the other characters, including the victims in their traps.

[Kat]

kMke8Em_Tdg

Anyone know, what song that is in the trailer?

[Jigsaw]

Some religious song, I think.

[Kat]

Found it. Irish hymn called Be Thou My Vision. I wonder how they got the rights to that one?

[Jigsaw]

I'm surprised religious groups aren't protesting the trailer, given the use of the song and the bible-esque verses in it.

[Ron]

It's kind of an uphill battle.

[Jack Bauer]

They do actually, but they blast the gore and violent nature of it. Then again a lot of other groups do. As long Jigsaw isn't saying he is in fact God, then no one would have a problem with it. Hell, no one has a problem with John's religious items around his deathbed.

[Kat]

I wish they'd write a book like this about SAW

http://books.google.ca/books?id=vfl_Nqy83uQC&dq=philosophy+of+the+simpsons&pg=PP1&ots=T-YquoYbaI&sig=r8EwIKePEGRLn0DKMLZY1BQilNE&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=1&ct=result

but Beyond Good and Evil By Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche or anything by Arthur Schopenhauer (SP?) is close enough I guess

[Jigsaw]

Killer Watched Saw Next To Victim's Corpse Following Slaying (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2008/09/02/2008-09-02_killer_smiled_as_he_bragged_to_dad_about.html)


Just what the media needs for their next scapegoat to blame real-life violence on :|

[Ron]

It really is a damn shame when you hear about something like that. The sad truth is, these films appeal to sick fucks and us normal people.

[Jigsaw]

Some sick fucks may not be into these movies, just look at Ted Bundy.

[DRE]

I'm surprised religious groups aren't protesting the trailer, given the use of the song and the bible-esque verses in it.

They're all busy at the RNC this week, maybe they'll get to it next week. ;)

[Jigsaw]

Ha, probably. Idiots like that have stomped all over the Horror genre and made it the black sheep of the movie industry.

[Kat]

Well, Dirty Harry apparently gave the Hi-Fi killers their ideas on how to kill their victims (and I think that is in the top 3 most horrendous crimes in American History). And Dirty Harry is a far cry from "sick and evil" horror movies. I'll be honest and frank, I am starting to dislike horror, but people that commit crimes because of movies and games, have some sort of issue beforehand...

Wasn't SAW on/in the news before, due to some killer having the billy doll tattooed on his arm?

[Jigsaw]

Yes, earlier this year. A campus shooter had a Billy tattoo.

[Ron]

Some sick fucks may not be into these movies, just look at Ted Bundy.

Very true..but it seems like many young murderers flock to these films like moths to a light. It's almost as if they see the killers in these films as heroes and these films are pretty much their only companions.

[Jigsaw]

The timing of this event is pretty bad too, with this happening just a whole month before the release of Saw V. Hope it doesnt create negative publicity. I remember how PC everything was right after the Columbine shootings and how sensitive to violence so many people became.

[Kat]

I seriously think this just brings more attention to it, honestly you wouldn't believe the number of CD's, movies or things that I bought or got into just because it was banned/or blacklisted. Like people that buy Harry Potter books to burn them...

There was one movie that a group bought out all the tickets, just so people wouldn't see the fucking thing.

[Ron]

Don't get me wrong, Columbine was a tragedy, but after all of the flack that movies and music artists caught for it, it only made the youth of America want that "taboo" entertainment like the Marshall Mathers LP (Which catapulted Mr.Mathers to the multi-million dollar success that he is today). It's all bullshit that film, video games, and music create all this violence. Senseless acts of violence have been here since the beginning of time and will remain, unfortunatley.

[Jigsaw]

Exactly. I mean what violent video game was Hitler playing when the Holocaust occured or what violent movie was Stalin watching when he committed his atrocities. The entertainment industry and media can't be blamed for real-life actions.

[DRE]

Not really liking that action figure. It does no justice to Amanda nor Shawnee.

[Jigsaw]

It's very inaccurate. NECA needs to get off their asses and make some Amanda figures, it's long overdue. Plus the Saw series is still very bankable and popular at the moment.

[DRE]

So only Jigsaw has an action figure?

[Jigsaw]

Yes, four different versions from NECA, though the pig-masked version could pass for Amanda, but maybe not since the body type is very obviously a man's.


http://www.mwctoys.com/images/review_cc5_8.jpg

[DRE]

I would like one of John in the hood, that would be cool.

[Jigsaw]

There already is one.


http://www.necaonline.com/images/product/42035/42035_blowup.jpg


I have all four of NECA's Jigsaw figures, they're definitely well worth getting if you're a hardcore Saw fan.

[DRE]

I like that one, and will look into getting all by the holidays.

[Jigsaw]

Good luck finding that one and the pig-masked variant, they've become very hard to find as of late. The Hall Of Fame refreshes aren't too hard to come by, though.

[DRE]

Really? Maybe I'll check Ebay and all, as long as I'm not paying $100 each I'll be fine.

[Jigsaw]

eBay is probably your best bet, or comic book shops near you. One comic shop near me has a lot of older Cult Classics figures and some of the older Movie Maniacs toys as well.

[Scarecrow]

Brillaint figures, I'd like to grab one one day when I can afford it.

- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

My favorite of the NECA figures is the one with John bald and with the hood over his head. All four of them are really good though, and are highlights of my collection.

[Ron]

I really like the realistic, detailed look.

[Jigsaw]

I just wish he had a more straight or upright posture instead of his "come get some" posture the figures have, Jigsaw never posed like that in the films.

[Don]

I cant help but feel there is probabably a thread elseware to discuss these figures as this is about a movie...

Im wondering how tightly under wraps they're going to keep this movie. How long it'll take for the spoilers to hit the next. Hopefully not until just before the movie comes out so itll be easier to avoid.

[Jigsaw]

There's a chance early spoilers could hit the internet right before release, and I'll be very careful and cautious to avoid them.

[Ron]

I know there's been plenty of phoney spoilers thus far. Some of them can be so ridiculous and are actually worth reading for a chuckle.

[Jigsaw]

There have been a lot of ridiculous fake spoilers released for all of the sequels over the years.

[jayTL]

I wonder if and when were going to get a full trailer. When were the other trailers released?

[Jigsaw]

I don't remember when the Saw II trailer was released, but Saw III was attached to The Descent back in August 2006 and Saw IV's trailer was attached to Halloween '07 back in August 2007, so sometime soon we should be getting a full trailer.

[Ron]

We should be getting one fairly soon. I may be wrong, but I think that the Halloween remake had the trailer for Saw IV. Or maybe it was just the teaser trailer. I can't remember which, but I'm sure Jigsaw would know. Jig?:)

[The Dark Vampire]

We should be getting one fairly soon. I may be wrong, but I think that the Halloween remake had the trailer for Saw IV. Or maybe it was just the teaser trailer. I can't remember which, but I'm sure Jigsaw would know. Jig?:)

I think he just may :D:p

[Sean [The Wildcard]]

If anything, as it pertains to another trailer, we should definitely get one soon.

Unless they're going the trailer route they did with SAW IV and releasing a teaser.

But hey...the teaser for IV sucked.

I'd actually prefer it if they at least released another TEASER, showing a bit more...but not too much.

[Jigsaw]

I like how the publicity for Saw V so much has revealed very little, that was a mistake the publicity for Saw III and IV made, too much revealed.

[Apocalypto]

I don't think the SAW III and IV promotion even gave an indication of what the films were about, just a few random clips of people screaming and some trap shots...I found it quite lazy.

It's like LG is so confident about this series they don't even feel the need to put out decent trailers, "eh, just slap the SAW title onscreen, that's all we need."

[Jigsaw]

Mildly New Teaser Poster Released, Slight Variation Of First Released Poster (http://www.shocktillyoudrop.com/news/topnews.php?id=7618)

[Jack Bauer]

DAMN YOU MARKETING TEAM! WHY ARE YOU MAKING ME CONFUSED!!!

:D

But I love how they setting up a great ending for this one.

[Jigsaw]

The ending to this has to be something very surprising, shocking and unexpected for them to be hyping it up as much as they are.

[Jack Bauer]

I know, and the marketing team has used lines from the films, maybe these are lines from the film.

[Jigsaw]

I doubt "You won't believe how it ends" will be used as an actual quote in the films :side:

[Kat]

I should buy some of those and eBay them. They have all the SAW figures in a shop here for 4.99 each right now...

[The Dream Master]

I want to say I saw the trailer for part 2 attached to The Exorcism of Emily Rose. For some reason, the only trailer that was really all that memorable for any of them was part 3. I'm not even sure if I ever saw a trailer for the original. I just remember reading about it on the old forum and found out Danny Glover was in it, so I was there opening day.

[Jigsaw]

Possible Return Of Key Saw IV Character? (http://www.lyriqbent.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=60&Itemid=72)


Click at your own risk, a potential spoiler, but in one of the pictures, Lyriq is seen with Megan Good, who's in Saw V. Could we see the return (and maybe possible survival) of Rigg?

[El Rooto]

YAY!

Can't stop Rigg!

Unless he cameos as a starving, nearly-dead guy.

[Jigsaw]

Hopefully he survives, it'd be good to finally have a survivor in this series for once.

[Scarecrow]

I saw the Saw trailer numerous times and was hooked... it was an amazingly well put together trailer which really sold the film as a terrifying thriller...

- Scarecrow

[Jigsaw]

I remember how excited the trailer for Saw III got me and a lot of other people when it was first released and how some people who recorded it in theaters leaked it online.

[DRE]

Sadly I don't think that signifies Rigg's return. Megan and Lyriq worked together on the cancelled UPN show "Kevin Hill" so that could have been a pic from around then. I'd love to see Rigg survive, and who knows, maybe they are keeping his survival (or onscreen death) a surprise. We'll see in a matter of weeks.

[Jigsaw]

I didn't know that Lyriq and Megan did a show together, but that still of them could very well be from that show. I too hope Rigg survives, even though it's not looking likely at the moment.

[Ron]

It may be a stretch, but I can see Rigg alive. I thought that Eric Matthews was done for, but the dude was like a cockroach!

[Jigsaw]

Eric went through some serious Hell over the duration of the series. The guy survived for six months inside a cramped, dingy cell with a destroyed foot that would've hurt like Hell.

[jeff_brister2004]

I think I'm done reading things like "New Saw V Info!" threads until the movie comes out. Last year I knew too much info...

[Ron]

I take it that your spoiler tags were meant as irony??

[Jigsaw]

I hate it when "news" is announced, only for it to be something like a Rick Roll :banghead:

[jeff_brister2004]

I take it that your spoiler tags were meant as irony??


Oh I just didn't wanna break habbit :)
ADDED:
In the trailer... one of the lines that pop up says that Jigsaw's "Love is Everlasting" does anyone else think that that line seems a bit odd? I know that Saw isn't your average Horror movie, but that line just seems odd to me.

[DRE]

Oh I just didn't wanna break habbit :)
ADDED:
In the trailer... one of the lines that pop up says that Jigsaw's "Love is Everlasting" does anyone else think that that line seems a bit odd? I know that Saw isn't your average Horror movie, but that line just seems odd to me.

It was meant to be a play on Jigsaw as Jesus Christ, and has followers.....

[Jigsaw]

I just finished watching Saw IV and watching the ending, it'd be so cruel if Saw V shows Rigg to be alive, only for Hoffman to kill him right away as a means of eliminating a loose end. I wouldn't be surprised if they did that in the film during the opening scene.

[DRE]

I wouldn't be surprised at all.

[Jigsaw]

It sure would be nice to see Rigg get back at Hoffman, though. And I wonder if Saw V will show that Hoffman was in fact the one responsible for Amanda's traps being unwinnable and all along, Amanda was just set up by him. Granted, she's still a murderer or at least an accomplice/accessory to it, but maybe Hoffman pinned the deaths of Troy and Kerry on her.

[El Rooto]

And I wonder if Saw V will show that Hoffman was in fact the one responsible for Amanda's traps being unwinnable and all along, Amanda was just set up by him. Granted, she's still a murderer or at least an accomplice/accessory to it, but maybe Hoffman pinned the deaths of Troy and Kerry on her.
What's with the interest in this idea? To make Amanda out to be less horrible?

[Jigsaw]

I've seen it suggested and theorized at various Saw boards for a while, even before the release of Saw IV. I first recall seeing it on IMDB.

I wonder if it wasn't just Amanda Hoffman may have set up, but maybe even Eric. For all we know, Eric was a law-abiding and good cop before Hoffman set him up and made him out to be a crooked SOB when all along he wasn't. One thing that is for certain is that there's more to Hoffman than meets the eye.

[El Rooto]

I doubt Hoffman set either of them up at all.

[Jigsaw]

I guess we'll know for sure come October 24th, and even then, it all may be vague and up for interpretation. It seems what Saw V will mainly do is clarify Hoffman's involvement with John and Amanda, and how he first got acquainted with them, and also focus on how he continues the legacy during the present time.

[Jack Bauer]

I wonder if they would explain Hoffman's family and saying he had a wife and child or something. You know making him more out to be a tragic villain. ;)

[Jigsaw]

I wonder if Hoffman actually has a family of his own or if he lives by himself. For some reason, I don't see him as the family man type...